Movieblob

Whine and Bitch about people long after they become interesting to talk about
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Re: Movieblob

Post by Guest » Sun Jun 25, 2017 11:29 am

rabidtictac wrote:
Sat Jun 17, 2017 12:52 am
The gamecube would have been much more successful if they hadn't used proprietary mini disks. That was Nintendo's own arrogance fucking them over. They wanted small discs so you couldn't pirate/hack (I think), but it ended up that the small disks were a pain to build games around.

Because the system was hard to make games for, fewer companies bothered to make games for it, leading to the smaller library. If the gamecube had a library on par with the Xbox original, it would have done better. Let alone if it had a library on par with the PS2.
Nintendo's arrogance has always put them back from the competition, "people don't want games on CD", "people don't want games in HD", "people don't want to play games online" and "people don't care about the quality of graphics", then wonder why third party support abandons them after launch.

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Re: Movieblob

Post by VoiceOfReasonPast » Sun Jun 25, 2017 1:51 pm

Don't forget third party developers not wanting to bother with stupid gimmick controls.
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Re: Movieblob

Post by rabidtictac » Sun Jun 25, 2017 5:58 pm

Nintendo proceeds to not give a fuck about third parties, wonders why their games always have shit third-party support.
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Re: Movieblob

Post by Keith Chegwin » Sun Jun 25, 2017 7:20 pm

rabidtictac wrote:
Sat Jun 17, 2017 12:52 am
The gamecube would have been much more successful if they hadn't used proprietary mini disks. That was Nintendo's own arrogance fucking them over. They wanted small discs so you couldn't pirate/hack (I think), but it ended up that the small disks were a pain to build games around.

Because the system was hard to make games for, fewer companies bothered to make games for it, leading to the smaller library. If the gamecube had a library on par with the Xbox original, it would have done better. Let alone if it had a library on par with the PS2.
I think you might be confusing the Gamecube with the N64. The thing with the Gamecube was that it was designed to be simpler to develop games for. The only issue with the miniDVDs was that they had less storage space overall than your standard DVD, which necessitated usually that bigger games were spread out over two disks, or they had to compress them to fit, or sometimes they would cut content.

Whereas the N64, they made that deliberately difficult to develop games for because Hiroshi Yamauchi, the then-President, said something along the lines of 'If you can't properly develop games for the N64 then we don't want your trash'. The cartridges were expensive and the cost usually got passed on to the consumers. Because the N64 was difficult to develop for, most third party developers didn't even bother and just put their games on the PS instead. The ones that did bother often put out buggy, glitchy messes due to development issues.

I think the failure of the Gamecube was down to three factors, A) It was late to the party. the PS2 and the Dreamcast were already out and the Xbox was launched around the same time, B) Lack of good third party exclusives due to alienation of third parties in the N64 era, which Iwata tried to mitigate and C) Because of low sales, most of the third party exclusives the Gamecube did get would inevitably end up on PS2 or Xbox eventually
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Re: Movieblob

Post by Pope Corky III » Sun Jun 25, 2017 7:26 pm

Keith Chegwin wrote:
Sun Jun 25, 2017 7:20 pm
rabidtictac wrote:
Sat Jun 17, 2017 12:52 am
The gamecube would have been much more successful if they hadn't used proprietary mini disks. That was Nintendo's own arrogance fucking them over. They wanted small discs so you couldn't pirate/hack (I think), but it ended up that the small disks were a pain to build games around.

Because the system was hard to make games for, fewer companies bothered to make games for it, leading to the smaller library. If the gamecube had a library on par with the Xbox original, it would have done better. Let alone if it had a library on par with the PS2.
Whereas the N64, they made that deliberately difficult to develop games for because Hiroshi Yamauchi, the then-President, said something along the lines of 'If you can't properly develop games for the N64 then we don't want your trash'. The cartridges were expensive and the cost usually got passed on to the consumers. Because the N64 was difficult to develop for, most third party developers didn't even bother and just put their games on the PS instead. The ones that did bother often put out buggy, glitchy messes due to development issues.
Devil's advocate: Maybe he was right? Look how cancerous for gaming Final Fantasy VII and Metal Gear Solid, arguably the two greatest PS games, turned out to be for gaming. Maybe if the PS wasn't available it would have forced those companies to cut out the FMVs and Animus. I love MGS by the way.
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Re: Movieblob

Post by rabidtictac » Sun Jun 25, 2017 7:30 pm

Keith, you said I was wrong and then went on to prove me right. The minidiscs were hard to make games for. Hence, fewer games were made. Nintendo was, is and continues to be unfriendly to third-party developers. Maybe they intended the minidiscs to be easier to develop for than N64 carts, but that shit was still less friendly than the standard CD/DVD disc format every other company under the sun was using.
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Re: Movieblob

Post by Keith Chegwin » Sun Jun 25, 2017 7:34 pm

Pope Corky III wrote:
Sun Jun 25, 2017 7:26 pm
Maybe if the PS wasn't available it would have forced those companies to cut out the FMVs and Animus.
But it was available. And even if it wasn't, Konami and Squaresoft would have probably made those same games for other consoles. Kojima originally wanted MGS on the 3DO. If Sony didn't make the Playstation somebody else somewhere else would have made something very similar. What Yamauchi did wasn't smart, he just cut his business in half.
rabidtictac wrote:
Sun Jun 25, 2017 7:30 pm
Keith, you said I was wrong and then went on to prove me right. The minidiscs were hard to make games for. Hence, fewer games were made.
Less storage /= difficult to develop for. The miniDVDs were not the reason the GameCube had a smaller library. developing a game for miniDVd was not much different to developing a game for a regular sized DVD
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Re: Movieblob

Post by VoiceOfReasonPast » Sun Jun 25, 2017 9:13 pm

What other difficulties can you run into with a disc-based storage medium aside from running out of space?
Keith Chegwin wrote:
Sun Jun 25, 2017 7:20 pm
Whereas the N64, they made that deliberately difficult to develop games for because Hiroshi Yamauchi, the then-President, said something along the lines of 'If you can't properly develop games for the N64 then we don't want your trash'. The cartridges were expensive and the cost usually got passed on to the consumers. Because the N64 was difficult to develop for, most third party developers didn't even bother and just put their games on the PS instead. The ones that did bother often put out buggy, glitchy messes due to development issues.
Lol, that reminds me of some Blizzardtard defending the user-unfriendly StarCraft 2 editor by going all "I approve of the editor scaring away stupid newbies, because then we will only see masterfully-crafted maps from expert editors". That worked out perfectly.
Last edited by VoiceOfReasonPast on Sun Jun 25, 2017 9:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Movieblob

Post by rabidtictac » Sun Jun 25, 2017 9:18 pm

Less storage = harder to put your games on the discs = you have to develop games from the ground up for the fucking minidiscs (and split your game into multiple discs) = harder to develop for = fewer games.

Every other system at the time was using DVD/CD discs. Dreamcast, PS2, Xbox, all using standard discs. Nintendo went with the shitty little discs because they were desperately afraid of piracy.
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Re: Movieblob

Post by FuckSploony » Sun Jun 25, 2017 9:25 pm

rabidtictac wrote:
Sun Jun 25, 2017 9:18 pm
Less storage = harder to put your games on the discs = you have to develop games from the ground up for the fucking minidiscs (and split your game into multiple discs) = harder to develop for = fewer games.

Every other system at the time was using DVD/CD discs. Dreamcast, PS2, Xbox, all using standard discs. Nintendo went with the shitty little discs because they were desperately afraid of piracy.
Didnt help anyways, tons of piracy on GC either way.

(Sorry for doublepost, erase the previous)

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